Members Dialogue: Homelessness, Power and Our Work!

Dialogue: Members discuss homelessness, power and our work.

WHAT CAUSES HOMELESSNESS?

John J: A broader answer for lots of people, in my case people interfered in my personal life and my wife left – they were calling my house and made her afraid.

Diane: I want to know about different things. It’s my experience too, there a lot of causes that people have, getting high and not paying bills, no job, no money, family problems…

Mike S: 1 and 2 are the same questions on different levels. 2 is more about systemic causes. It’s just as important to list underlying causes: the economy, housing policy (like how many people live in public housing and are forced out because they aren’t allowed to stay there).

Charley: It is a condition of the human heart. Like Jean says at every meeting, if one person’s civil rights are violated then all of us are less free. My feeling is that it is a measure of the quality of the civilization that we live in… we’re supposed to have a free and open democracy when elements are crimped and broken up then we…it has to do with human frailty. We have to strengthen ourselves in areas of compassion to end homelessness.

James R. For me it’s more of a personal attitude, why he’s homeless: hygiene, not giving a damn about himself or anybody else, simply just giving up on himself.

Baxter: What I want to know, what are the main factors that has it increasing.

Jerome: Speaking from personal experience I am from the 60’s when there was a nuclear family. The family unit has definitely fallen apart. No one has room for you, even if they have a 12 room apartment. Everything you do is a problem and then you got to go. The family unit and society has broken down. People can’t live with their husbands or wives: a lot of people say that: “ I can’t live with so and so”.

Larry (counts on fingers): You got natural disasters, like with Hurricane Katrina in New Orleans, you can have a fire, you can get fired, you can lose a principal breadwinner, anything.

Darrell: When I was fighting to keep my last apartment, I had lost my job, I was two months behind on my rent, PA told me unless my building exploded I couldn’t get any support—no one shot deals, no rent relief, nothing.

Angelo: For thirty years I lived in rooms, never in an apartment of my own. And nowadays, rooms have gone up a lot. You can’t get a hundred dollar a week room anymore.

Andre: I went to see a room the other day, it was twisted. No windows, a pipe instead of a radiator, bathroom down the hall—$300 they wanted.

Larry: Also, you have landlords, they see gentrification coming like in East Harlem and Harlem and the Bronx, and they go make some “structural changes” so they can get the city to pay for it with a subsidy or a grant or a loan from HPD, and then they can circumvent rent stabilization and jack up the rents. The landlords and developers see a community on the upswing and they want to get rid of the people been there ten, twenty years. And if you’re not a senior, they’re going to get rid of you.

Andre: New York is top of the line when it comes to homelessness. If you go down to Mississippi, and you see how poor people are living down there, it’s twisted. Tore up from the floor up. When it comes to giving away money, housing, food—we’re doing great. First of the month there’s no line at the soup kitchens here. Down there you see starving kids, busted up trailers, people living in trucks.

William: There’s accidental causes, like unemployment and fires or drugs and things—but those are particular causes. There’s an overarching cause, which is that overall housing costs have been allowed to skyrocket so far from the reality of people’s income. So there are justice issues, when it comes to the understanding of housing as a right. Accidents can happen—accidents always happen—but accidents can be overcome. If there’s justice, and people have a right to housing, you can afford to get a new place after the fire.

Larry: You go somewhere else, Georgia, DC, Maryland, and the skills you’ve gotten just from living in NYC are really marketable. Sometimes you have to just say, “this place isn’t for me.” New York, now, is for people with money.

Darrell: Drug addiction. Top three.

Roosevelt: Yeah, but there’s a lot of guys who are drug addicts who aren’t homeless. I know a lot of those guys. Economic issues are the main thing. I’ve partied with doctors, lawyers, firemen, police officers—with nice homes, families… the best weed you ever saw, and more coke than you can shake a stick at.

Andre: But that’s how the system sees shit. That’s how they see us—that’s the reality. Crack is expensive, you know? Five dollars here, twenty dollars there—you hear crackheads saying “I just spent two hundred dollars last night!” and people see that, the public sees that, and they say, you can spend that much money in a night why can’t you get a place?

William: I had a trauma surgeon offer to pay me to go buy a gram of coke. He said he had more to lose than me.

WHAT DOES HOMELESS MEAN TO YOU?

Rogers: I have gotten to the point where I understand that landless and homeless are part of the same struggle. A global picture of landless means the same thing as homeless.

Baxter: It means poverty, vulnerability to the rich, a denial of our constitutional and civil rights, we are branded and labeled to be ignorant – all these factors make you vulnerable to the so called powerful. You are like meat to be preyed on.

DESCRIBE YOUR EXPERIENCE BEING HOMELESS

Larry: Devastating.

Frank: I second that.

Larry: Slow death.

Darrell: No slower or faster than being in an apartment.

Roosevelt: My first time, I was terrified. What am I going to do, can I sleep here, can I sleep there? And it seems someone’s always watching you. I’d been on the street enough that I know when someone’s eye is on me. You see these homeless guys in parks and stuff, they move every fifteen minutes! And I’m going to work, I’m stinking, I don’t know what I’m going to do about a shower, I’m riding the trains, the PATH… I finally had this guy really show me the ropes.

Angelo: I was homeless and didn’t know it. I lived in a room so long… I had no place of my own. My name wasn’t on the lease. Then I was on the subway all day long, dirty, stinking. I ended up homeless because I won a case against my landlord in court… I was living in a room in her place and she thought because it was her place she could just go in my room, so when I won my case against her she got back at me by accusing me of a crime and I spent six months on Rikers. When I got out, all my stuff had been thrown away. All I had when I left was a jacket a drug dealer gave me—because it was cold when I got out, snowing on Queens Boulevard.

Andre: I was on the street a long time and I learned all the tricks. The places for clothing… how to sleep at the library but look like I’m reading, how to hustle, I’d spend hours running up to people around Penn Station saying, “I lost my wallet, I have to get back to Rockland County,” you know… and I’d shock myself. Sometimes sixty to seventy dollars a day.

Conrad: I’ve been homeless ten years, and I’ve never spent a night in a shelter. I’ve lived my whole life in Harlem. I always paid three hundred dollars a month for a place, and that’s why I’m here. That’s why a lot of us are here. Because you don’t have that rent anymore. Those places are gone. So I’m sleeping in the park, in a tent. Other guys respect me, they don’t mess with me.

Larry: I wouldn’t wish it on my enemies. The other day I’m going to the bathroom and I see this cop
watching me. You know what that’s like? To be afraid to go to the bathroom?

WHAT DOES HOMELESS FEEL LIKE TO YOU?

John J: I am just homeless, not hopeless or worthless

Avery: It is like the philosophy like when they inducted our civil rights that we all should have them and then you feel deprived and that they are taken away

Angelo: I had privacy, it was stripped away, you have to be around people who are obnoxious.

Mike W: It can also be educational to be homeless. You can learn from being homeless to not go back out there.

John J: I was always taught that this is where you don’t want to end up – being homeless.

HOW DOES BEING PART OF PICTURE THE HOMELESS MAKE YOU FEEL?

Mike S: Empowered. (“That’s because you got a check today” John Jones jokes to group laughter) No that makes me feel worthy replied Mike. PTH just makes me feel like I can make a difference then the Margaret Mead quote about a small group of people can change the world.

Avery: Yeah, I love that word empowered. One voice can make a difference, even though it might be one voice for that minute.

Mike S: Everything has to start somewhere, even with one person. It’s like I’m not alone and the struggle to right some of the wrongs –even if one person can make a difference it is still better when that voice is heard and agreed with by other people to really make change.

Diane: Meeting a lot of new friends, learning how to open up and talk. Bruce is the one who told me about this place, it is also good to help me get through my struggles.

Mike W.: It makes me feel appreciated and loved. (John J joking “you are?” everyone laughed. Then Mike talking about incident a few years ago when he got mad and banged his head on the door)

WHAT POWER DO YOU HAVE AS A MEMBER OF PICTURE THE HOMELESS?

Darrell: Numerical power. The more names we have, the more they can see that people are standing up. NYC is being flipped, from lower-income to upper-income, the ghettos are being shrunk. They try to make power through numbers, right? So that’s what we’ll do too. If a couple thousand names don’t have power, what does? Outside of cash and a gun, what else has power?

Roosevelt: PTH comes up with solutions. We’re not here just venting and griping. And we’re committed to doing something proactive, and there’s a lot of power in that.

Darrell: As you can see, homeless people are not all crazy, or addicts. The upper class has this idea that it’s on you—that where you’re at is your fault 100%. We need to show how that’s not true.

Larry: You’re with an organization! You have access to everything from computers to books to politicians—and positive attitudes. If you don’t think you’re going to do anything, you won’t. If you don’t think you can get housing, you won’t. So being around positive and focused people makes you positive and focused.

Andre: A major problem isn’t homelessness. It’s jobs. If they can spend thousands to put a man on the moon, they can give him a job. It’s like the Bible says, give a man a fish and he’ll eat dinner tonight, teach a man to fish and he’ll eat every night. The shelter system is like a pacifier, it’s like crack. It keeps people quiet. Being in PTH gives us the power to speak up. We need to start demanding more, not less. We’re only in homelessness because we let them take control. Now we’re going to have to take control. This shit has been going on too long. The party’s over.

Larry: We’re in a capitalist system, where you need to depress the wages you can make more profits, and where you need a big pool of out of work people so the people who do have jobs know there’s someone right behind them who’s real hungry. If you’re a man and you’re past 25, society writes you off.

Roosevelt: since I’ve been with PTH I’ve learned a lot—about the city, about my rights, I’m empowered because there’s a lot of knowledge here. A lot of knowledgeable people.

Pearl: Now I have the power to go out and meet with people in power and let them know what’s going on.

Andre: Out of all the people who come here every week, we’re only a small percentage of the homeless population. A lot of them are comfortable being homeless. We’re trying to climb a very big hill here, and there’s a lot of obstacles. We’re beating our heads against the wall if everybody doesn’t come up with us. Otherwise the people in power will say “if all these homeless people are unhappy with the system, where are they?”

Roosevelt: So… you’re disempowered working with PTH?

Andre: No, I’m saying—it’s a weak spot we have.

Angelo: Poverty’s a business.

Roosevelt: Homelessness is a business.

WHAT BENEFITS DO YOU GET FROM BEING PART OF PICTURE THE HOMELESS?

Bruce: Empowerment, being able to know that you aren’t alone, meeting other people with the same problems and someone else to talk to – and the trips! I went to S. Carolina, San Francisco, Albany, Canada. Being able to speak and not be afraid to talk about PTH and to be proud.

Rachael: Well nothing, no, helping, talking, parties, I’ve learned a lot of educational things.

Rogers: Organizational trainings

Avery: It’s you Bruce, you are the benefit, I learned about it through you! (general laughter, Bruce gets embarrassed)

Everybody: Turn on the fan, open the window, Bruce is sweating!

Jerome: Can we get a group hug here?

Rogers: It is about us being a community, with a history, we know each other.

HAVE YOU EVER BEEN INVOLVED IN SOCIAL JUSTICE WORK BEFORE?

Jerome: During the 60’s I went to the March on Washington, I was down with the hip hop Khalid Mohammed, with Sharpton, that’s what makes this here organization a shining light – we are talking in the same tradition – this group is standing for something. Like they say “if you don’t stand up for something, you’ll fall for anything.” We aren’t like those other groups, like legal aid, how can they be defending you when they are taking the government’s money?

Rachael: Sometimes we do get things done.

Rogers: This is part of a continuum – the struggle for justice – there is a link between homelessness and the struggle for justice. Sometimes being homeless itself is a result of a moral choice. Being men and women of conscience has sometimes cost us our families, homeless and even thousands of dollars. There is a religious overlay, a call from our religious teachings, we are about being and doing right before, after and during our periods of homelessness because this is who we are, moral people.

Baxter: Religious, hell no! Laughter and discussion erupts

John J: I am not religious, just spiritual.

Rogers: You miss my point. What I am saying is not that most religious people are moral but that most moral people are at their core, religious.

Baxter: I find most religions and religious people corrupt.

Jerome: (attempting consensus) Let’s just say, not religious, but God fearing

WHAT DO YOU HAVE IN COMMON WITH OTHER POOR PEOPLE?

Dilo: What we got in common is that we are in the home of the lies, the land of the deceptions, and where dead end dreams come. This is what I heard before I came to America.

Rogers: The point of view that I have learned from dealing with others is that people in Zimbabwe without land, burning cars in Paris, living in favelas in Brazil…rich landowners everywhere means pushing people off of the land. So homelessness in NYC …people in S Africa, Poland, Uzbekistan they are having the same discussions as we are and fighting the same fight.

John J: I would have to say regardless to the cause of homelessness (because there can be so many) Our government has made provisions and they are supposed to be doing something about it and that is what we have in common. There could be people in a free society who are rich and chose to be homeless.

Avery: You always want to be singled out as different and special. You are in a dream state if you want to achieve something. One thing that we have in common is that we are all striving to live better.

Jean: You can’t solve a global problem with a local solution.

James R: Pandemic

Jean: It’s true that our government is culpable. We can’t let the Rothchild’s off the hook. It’s the international cartels behind closed doors in a less than democratic forum who have marginalized poor whites and people of color who are really to blame. They are the true enemy.

Rogers: We are all dealing with failed government and economic policies that exploit us.

WHY DID YOU COME TO PICTURE THE HOMELESS IN THE FIRST PLACE?

Bruce: I’m going to be honest. First it was the pizza and the metrocards – I mean tokens that’s how long ago it was. (laughter) Then after I got here I found out what they could do for me. But first it was the pizza, I ain’t gonna lie.

Avery: Curiosity, I’m a be honest, then I found out about the pizza. We all want to belong to something. I’m down with the fight if there is a purpose.

Diana: What pizza? (Lynn: you have to come to the general membership meeting!) Well it was also the movies (laughter and looking at Bruce – What movies Bruce?) No the PTH videos that we saw.

John: To piggy back on Avery. It was curiosity when Lynn did outreach to me and invited me I saw it as a way to help myself, I didn’t know about the pizza and tokens yet. It was easier to sell tokens and and we did eat. A bunch of us got together and went to a Chinese restaurant after the meetings right before they closed and they sold us everything they had left for just $1.50 and we could eat until the next meeting. It helped us out. People are now earning money, are in shelters and we used it as a platform to elevate ourselves.

Mike S: First and foremost it was the food, but I will say the food wouldn’t have been enough to keep me if I didn’t see the benefit of what PTH is doing.

Rogers: It feeds your soul.

Mike Williams: It’s satisfying knowing that you are doing something that most people would never have thought of doing. Most people would never think of working with an organization founded and led by homeless people – it wouldn’t occur to them that it existed!! Fighting to change the laws and the things that the government is doing to criminalize homeless people – this is satisfying.

Angelo: As Mike said, you can do things under an organizations name that is run by homeless people. Other groups, they don’t want you to step out of where you are told to go. Here you can roam around and do what you need to do, other places they have guards and you can’t go just anywhere.

Charley: That has changed!!! Before, (at another organization) you could walk in and talk to people to get what you need, now they are on their 5th or 6th degenerative level. You have to be there by 9am and then sit in a room and wait. If you show up at 2 in the afternoon the GUARD says “come back tomorrow!”.